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Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.15 18:19:00 - [1] Originally by: Trevor Warps Originally by: Merin Ryskin BB: no. CS: no. BC: no. HAC: no. HIC: no. Recon: no. T1 cruiser: yes. AF: yes. Stealth bomber: no. Inty: no. T1 frigate: yes. EAF: no. I'm wondering what stuff your drinking, what stuff your smoking .... or what game your playing. It looks realistic enough to me. What parts do you disagree with?
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.15 18:35:00 - [2] Edited by: Gypsio III on 15/10/2008 18:35:03 I think the point is not that the Deimos can't kill those ships if it can tackle them, but that it can't realistically tackle them with any degree of reliability. HAC - will either kite it or be too far off Recon - likewise Inty - yeah same again EAF - and again Stealth bomber - range and cloak
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 11:16:00 - [3] Edited by: Gypsio III on 16/10/2008 11:17:49 Quote: To sum it up, my opinion is that Deimos is a good damage dealer in a proper gang. I just don't see it, myself. It delivers sub-BC levels of DPS at point-blank range, and dies laughably quickly when shot at. Its mobility advantage over a Myrm or Brutix is fairly inconsequential, and blasters themselves are subpar in a larger gang where you have to MWD to every target. If you have a warp-in point such that you don't have to MWD to your target, then the mobility advantage is even less meaningful.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 11:51:00 - [4] Originally by: Vrabac Well over 700, 2km optimal, 7km faloff with ions and faction ammo. That's sub BC? It's probably only hac that can do (high) BC level of dps. Sure hurricane can do over 800, but with worse limitations in optimal, faloff AND agility/speed that's important when you have to mwd around as you said yourself, since for that damage it will be needing hail. Not to mention that hurricane is in almost every regard a superior ship (as I already said before). And deimos dies as fast as any other tanked hac does. Try thinking of a better low slot concept. Harbinger can do 760 DPS at 7.5 km, Drake can do 618 DPS at ~19 km, Myrm can do 824 DPS at 2.3 km. It's not that the Deimos isn't effective in the right situations - it's more that in those situations, a BC would be more effective.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 13:10:00 - [5] That seems to be a badly-fit sniper, two terribly-fit Drakes and a badly-fit Harbinger. The Rapier kill is nice, although I don't think you can really count on being able to do that regularly, and the Mega kill is also nice, although neither fit seems ideal. On the other hand, I could link the mails of the Deimos that I've killed in my Drake while taking sentry fire, or the one that took just 13 volleys of HAMs, or the one whose shield buffer lasted longer than his armour tank.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 17:23:00 - [6] Originally by: Fistme Deimos is ALLOT faster, has more dps and has much better range. Brutix has a big tank advantage and that's about it. I'm not sure how you're fitting a Brutix to have less DPS than a Deimos.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 18:40:00 - [7] Originally by: Fistme As always the forum is full of EFT warriors. An EFT warrior assumes that the listed dps in EFT is the Ingame damage that the ship will put out. When it comes to blasters in particular you need to start taking a look at range of weapons, speed of ship, lock on time, acceleration ect. when trying to determine how much dmg that ship is going to inflict in a fight. Very true. Let's look at optimal range, shall we? Oh fancy that, they're exactly the same. Falloff of the Deimos is 3 km greater, which is pretty insignificant, isn't it? Lock-time is inconsequential if we're assuming that both ships lock before getting into firing range. To make lock time meaningful you need to start in firing range - whereupon the mobility advantage of the Deimos is irrelevant, and its weak tank is rapidly exposed. Acceleration and speed is a good point, although the Deimos cripples its advantage hereby having to fit a plate if it wants any sort of tank, which doesn't apply to the Brutix or Myrm obviously. But there's a catch - as you point out, if the time to get into optimal is really important, then you don't want a blaster ship at all. All in all, the situations where a Deimos is a better choice than a Brutix or Myrm are those where really you don't want any of the three.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 20:09:00 - [8] By that I mean situations where the mobility advantage of the Deimos is important - important in getting into or out of range, that sort of thing. In those situation, the Deimos is certainly a better choice than a Myrm or Brutix. However, in a situation where mobility and the effective projection of DPS is important, then a Deimos isn't an ideal choice either - because really you'll want something faster, or something that can project DPS better, such as a Sacrilege, Cerberus or Zealot. Or a sentry-Ishtar, or even a rail-Deimos.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.16 20:44:00 - [9] Originally by: Trevor Warps So your saying that a better option to a Deimos, could be a Deimos ? Hmmk, yeah, right ... I think I got it. Its really a broken ship, isnt it ? Well, when you have supposedly the premier blaster cruiser frequently better off fitting rails, it does kinda suggest that something's not quite right.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.17 13:18:00 - [10] Originally by: Cpt Branko Unless you have a alt with a ship scanner, any of those fights could've turned into 100% suicide. And when you're into the whole do or die business, I prefer doing it in a cheaper, insurable (and more effective) BC. I'd prefer a BC so I know that, if by chance I run into a PVP fitted Hurricane/Harbringer/Drake/etc I can fight rather then provide a free 100M+ lossmail. Not only this, but you could have taken a Brutix or Myrm into each of those fights and had more DPS with more EHP.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.10.17 16:07:00 - [11] Or even: 7x Neutron II MWD, web, scram, LSE II DC II, 3x MFS II, RCU II shield hardener rigs 5x HH II 860 DPS, 42k EHP. Less EHP, but more DPS and no expensive rigs.

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